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Comments on: In defence of GWB http://sbbs.johnband.org/2005/09/in-defence-of-gwb/ As fair-minded and non-partisan as Torquemada. Wed, 07 Mar 2012 07:16:20 +0000 hourly 1 By: john b http://sbbs.johnband.org/2005/09/in-defence-of-gwb/#comment-8494 Wed, 07 Sep 2005 18:53:00 +0000 http://sbbs.johnband.org/?p=1361#comment-8494 Now that’s intriguing (the Mayor’s defection). One of the positive things about the horribleness of all this is that it’s utterly fucked any Repugnican effort to nick the black vote…

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By: Gregg http://sbbs.johnband.org/2005/09/in-defence-of-gwb/#comment-8492 Wed, 07 Sep 2005 18:51:00 +0000 http://sbbs.johnband.org/?p=1361#comment-8492 However, the mere fact that the flood relief effort in New Orleans massively fucked up is not an indictment of the President. The fault lies partly, and perhaps primarily, with New Orleans’ (Democratic) mayor and Louisiana’s (Democratic) governor

Actually, no. The failure to evacuate the city before the hurricane hit, and to properly police shelters within the city, lies with the Governor and the Mayor, though there are signs that the President contributed to that (by refusing to approve the transfer of National Guard units from other states to Louisiana before the hurricane hit). You could also argue that they and their predecessors, over the course of many years, failed to adequately prepare for a natural disaster like this, and other things may have complicated the situation (emergency mangement in New Orleans was privatised last year, though I’ve not yet seen a clear report of what this involved or how it impacted on preparing for emergencies such as this). But the refusal to answer calls to help the state authorities before the hurricane hit, and the failure in the relief and evacuation efforts after the hurricane and flooding, is the President’s fault (because those derilictions were either his own doing or down to people in his administration, people he appointed and apparently appointed on an entirely partisan basis). Not only did federal authorities fail to answer requests for help until three days after the flooding (requests that started two days before the hurricane hit New Orleans), they actually prevented other agencies (local and state auhtorities, charities and private organisations) providing relief.

(Incidentally, the Mayor of New Orleans was a Republican until he decided to run for Mayor, and was both a contributor to and campaigner for George W. Bush. I guess if he wasn’t sincere in abandoning the Republicans for the Democrats before, he certainly must be now.)

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By: Ben P http://sbbs.johnband.org/2005/09/in-defence-of-gwb/#comment-8466 Tue, 06 Sep 2005 21:33:00 +0000 http://sbbs.johnband.org/?p=1361#comment-8466 A lot of what I would say has already been said.

But, from a US historian, your notion of how the federal (read central) government relates to the states is over a 100 years out of date. Especially in a disaster of this magnitude, the Feds are frankly expected to step in, an expectation they have largely created for themselves over a 100 years of precedent and action (perhaps even 150 years, if you go back to the Civil War and Lincoln’s massive expansion of the federal government). I would argue that in a disaster of this scale, FEMA, the National Guard, as well as the US military (not to mention the fairly dysfunctional Dep’t of Homeland security) all have vital, central roles to play. Others, including the Dept of Transportation, the Dept of Energy, the Dept of the Interior, and the Bureau of Reclamation all have vital roles to play considering the disruption of interstate commerce (vis a vis Mississippi shipping, as well as the damage taken by the Gulf energy fields) and the environmental destruction the hurricane has caused (underreproted, but very significant), not to mention the simple disruption of interstate travel, and the massive refugee crisis (a million plus people now without homes for a long time to come)

But this is just is just talking about pure logistical and bureaucratic questioons. The President – again, established through precedent more than law, but it has nevertheless has come to be vital function expected of the President by the American people – has a vital role as moral and emotional leader in a time of crisis like this. Bush clearly fell down in this regard for much of last week, too.

So while I think it is clear that Bush is not solely responsible for the crisis (its really a broader federal gov’t failure, not the failure of the President or the Presidency), and while it is also true that state and local authorities deserve blame, the scale and nature of this disaster demands the federal govenernment’s role be paramount. And since Bush is the nation’s figurehead as well as the de jure manager of the federal apparatus, he only should be the focus of the blame.

Ben P

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By: Hell Is Other People http://sbbs.johnband.org/2005/09/in-defence-of-gwb/#comment-8463 Tue, 06 Sep 2005 18:45:00 +0000 http://sbbs.johnband.org/?p=1361#comment-8463 Why are you "in two minds" about positive discrimination? Racism is not simply a negative phenomenon that makes some people worse off; it makes them worse off both BECAUSE and THEREFORE it makes others better off, ie whites benefit from racism – whether they themselves are racist as individuals.

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By: Backword Dave http://sbbs.johnband.org/2005/09/in-defence-of-gwb/#comment-8457 Tue, 06 Sep 2005 13:29:00 +0000 http://sbbs.johnband.org/?p=1361#comment-8457 Andrew, I think you’re right, re the sensible right-wing. But note that Bush is in power, and quite a few of the sensible right were "down with Clinton." I think Bush’s platform is against almost everything I believe in.
Also blacks as a group are not in power. Down-with-blacks, one might say, is the status quo, and requires political inertia rather than political activism. What I’m trying to say is, if you did think "Down-with-blacks" the best program would be: do nothing. I don’t know what would be a good program for "Up-with-blacks." I’m in two minds on positive discrimination, for instance.

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By: Andrew http://sbbs.johnband.org/2005/09/in-defence-of-gwb/#comment-8450 Tue, 06 Sep 2005 11:43:00 +0000 http://sbbs.johnband.org/?p=1361#comment-8450 Matt: Fair point, but I’d say the ‘Down-with-Bush’ type of anti-Americanism is far more prevalent amongst the non-extreme left than the ‘Down-with-Blacks’ tendency is amongst the non-extreme right. Of course, as a sensible (I hope) right-winger, I would say that.

it doesn’t exactly engage with John’s question of whether GWB is to blame.

No, it doesn’t. It engages with Alex’s comment about the Decent Left assuming a default ‘support Bush’ position on many issues.

As d^2 suggests, we’re rather left with the dichotomy of Bush either being a blithering idiot, or a heartless bastard.

True, but the tendency seems to be to assume the latter, when the former is much more likely to be true. And d^2 may have suggested it, but I stated it pretty explicitly previously when I said this:

Well, that’s really my point. Isn’t that more likely to be cock-up rather than conspiracy? I’ll freely admit that Bush seems more prone than the average US President to making cock-ups, but that’s hardly evidence of actual malice, just incompetence.

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By: Matt Daws http://sbbs.johnband.org/2005/09/in-defence-of-gwb/#comment-8448 Tue, 06 Sep 2005 10:59:00 +0000 http://sbbs.johnband.org/?p=1361#comment-8448 Dave, Yes, very good point. I indeed had an old resident of NO tell me yesterday that he wouldn’t have left: it would have been "good to see a hurricane, and how much damage could it cause?" However, you would have hoped that the authorities might have planned for this eventuality? Namely, "what do we do if people do not leave their homes, but then the levees do break and we have to recuse them?"

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By: Backword Dave http://sbbs.johnband.org/2005/09/in-defence-of-gwb/#comment-8446 Tue, 06 Sep 2005 10:55:00 +0000 http://sbbs.johnband.org/?p=1361#comment-8446 Everyone seems to be discussing whether blame lies with the state (in this case Lousiana) or the federal government. But, AFAIK, no one has discussed how credible government warnings (from any branch) are. If you read of an approaching disaster, what would you do? Both John B and I are doubters when it comes to our own government’s warnings on terrorism. And it seems to me that if Mark Steyn had been in New Orleans nine days ago, he’d have been snorting about how often the government is wrong. (As he pretty much did in his Telegraph article last week.) As it turned out the warnings were correct, but how was anyone to know they would be? If there had been a 100% evacuation, would things have been better? Fewer deaths, of course, but where would they go? And whose responsibility would they be?

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By: Matt Daws http://sbbs.johnband.org/2005/09/in-defence-of-gwb/#comment-8442 Tue, 06 Sep 2005 10:08:00 +0000 http://sbbs.johnband.org/?p=1361#comment-8442 These examples</a> represent your brand of conservatism? We can all play at pointing out the logical inconsistences and outright hatred on both of the extremes of the debate (you might also like to check out the hateful spew of Bruce Anderson in the Indi, which was also too soon after the event to be informed by fact) but it doesn't exactly engage with John's question of wether GWB is to blame. Also, I'd rather be chanting "Down with Bush" than "Down with The Blacks", which seems to be the rallying cry of the hard-right...]]> Andrew, further to this, I’m not sure what your point is by posting lots of silly "left-wing" views from the web? After all, do These examples represent your brand of conservatism? We can all play at pointing out the logical inconsistences and outright hatred on both of the extremes of the debate (you might also like to check out the hateful spew of Bruce Anderson in the Indi, which was also too soon after the event to be informed by fact) but it doesn’t exactly engage with John’s question of wether GWB is to blame. Also, I’d rather be chanting "Down with Bush" than "Down with The Blacks", which seems to be the rallying cry of the hard-right…

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By: Matt Daws http://sbbs.johnband.org/2005/09/in-defence-of-gwb/#comment-8440 Tue, 06 Sep 2005 09:52:00 +0000 http://sbbs.johnband.org/?p=1361#comment-8440 Andrew, well there does seem to be a pattern of Bush appointing his mates to the top jobs, rather than appointing anyone who’s actually qualified. Now, whether that’s malice or incompetance, I don’t know. As d^2 suggests, we’re rather left with the dicotomy of Bush either being a blithering idiot, or a heartless bastard. Neither is very appealing…

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