Comments on: Benedict XVI

By: Graeme

Graeme — Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:52:00 +0000

What people do is between themselves and God. You shouldnt judge other people whatsoever. I personally dont agree with homosexuality, however, Jesus said, ‘ let he who is without sin cast the first stone’. What ha happened to loving thy neighbour? God loves you more than you or your family love you; dont you think he would be annoyed if you went around juding people he loves? Christ didnt hang around with perfect people he help those who were sinners, follow in his example and be a good christian regardless of denomination.

By: Gert

Gert — Sat, 23 Apr 2005 10:30:00 +0000

Hmm, homosexu Laity is not bad as spelling mistakes go, in this context…

By: Gert

Gert — Sat, 23 Apr 2005 10:29:00 +0000

I get pissed off with the eprverted obsession of all these celibate men with what other people do in bed.

Just suppose, for argument's sake, that I believed homosexuality to be a sin, that would be quite an important issue for me to make a stand on.

But it would also be reasonable to assume that I believed that lying, or being a bit ratty, or not doing the washing up, or jumping queues, or not recycling my rubbish are also sins, and sins that more people commit, and that have a greater impact on others, and therefore, I ought to make a big stand about the immorality of being a bit ratty, just as much as I would about homosexulaity.

By: Eddie

Eddie — Fri, 22 Apr 2005 12:52:00 +0000

I think the new Pope will be a great opportunity for Germany to rediscover itself. Ever since WW II it has had a kind of national identity crisis.

By: Larry

Larry — Fri, 22 Apr 2005 12:12:00 +0000

Actually, for once, I entirely agree with you. Though I think a bit of reform is not entirely beyond possibility and would also be positive. I.e best case scenario: people leave in droves, but those who remain reform.

By: Squander Two

Squander Two — Fri, 22 Apr 2005 12:04:00 +0000

Yes, I understand that reasoning, but I think people could do more good by abandoning the Church in droves, thereby decreasing its power and maybe even helping along its ultimate demise, than by trying, usually in vain, to reform it.

By: Larry

Larry — Fri, 22 Apr 2005 08:15:00 +0000

"so do Catholics in left-wing secular Guardian-reading constantly-hectoring-the-Pope-for-killing-Africans communities"

Thanks, that's put a smile on my face like a Cheshire Cat's.

"Best thing is not to let it get to you."

Well that and (if you feel strongly enough about it) to try put pressure on the relevant institution to reform and correct the iniquity, thereby improving the lot of others in future who find themselves in your position.

By: Squander Two

Squander Two — Fri, 22 Apr 2005 07:58:00 +0000

> No, they worship God.

No, they worship the Catholic Church and God. If they worshipped only God, none of this would be a problem for them.

> have their lives made pretty nasty by never-ending judgemental moralising.

And so do Catholics in left-wing secular Guardian-reading constantly-hectoring-the-Pope-for-killing-Africans communities. And atheists in Muslim communities. And so on. Such is life. Best thing is not to let it get to you.

> Well, that cuts no ice with people who believe their soul is at risk, now, does it?

It clearly cuts ice with some of them, or no-one would ever leave the Church and neither Protestantism nor atheism would exist. For the rest of them, well, their arguments cut no ice with me and mine cut none with them. What's the big deal? The world is full of people unable to persuade each other of their point of view. I don't see why homosexuality and Catholicism are a special case deserving of so much attention. As long as it doesn't turn into violence, really, what does it matter?

> No, all my own for better or worse.

Fair enough. I thoroughly recommend Russell's essay on the differences between Catholic atheism and Protestant atheism. Can't remember what it's called (helpfully enough), but it's in the "Why I Am Not A Christian" collection, and is very interesting.

By: dave heasman

dave heasman — Fri, 22 Apr 2005 07:32:00 +0000

"You mean, what if they're determined to worship an organisation that hates them?"

No, they worship God. In a way, using a rite, and doing good works, that they believe will bring them salvation.

> you seem to be a Protestant atheist.

Hey, is that a Bertrand Russell reference?

No, all my own for better or worse. You were talking like a Protestant, about leaving a church. That's not what catholics do.

> I'm simply overflowing with sympathy for that sort of self-destructive idiocy.

Well, that cuts no ice with people who believe their soul is at risk, now, does it?

By: Larry

Larry — Fri, 22 Apr 2005 07:23:00 +0000

Well ok. Arguably the official KKK doesn't (theoretically) routinely kill or torture black men any more, it just burns crosses occasionally whilst wearing comedy clothes. Run for the hills indeed.

But still I do think that you miss the point that "the Church's attitudes have social consequences beyond its own members". Plenty of gay people in catholic communities (irrespective of their own beliefs) have their lives made pretty nasty by never-ending judgemental moralising. "Oo, criticism. Run for the hills." is a bit glib, I think.